It was not a trick, and for two kids in Lewiston, it definitely was not a treat.
Idaho is making national news, but not necessarily in a good way. The Lewiston Tribune reported Friday that two officials from the Idaho State Tax Commission forced the children of Dan and Kami Charais to close a stand in front of their home used to sell pumpkins. The kids, 4- and 6-years-old, the parents told the paper, were selling the products to raise money for sports and other activities.
The reason for the closure? An unnamed official with the tax commission said that even a roadside stand is required to obtain proper permits in order to do business in the state. The agency also said the kids must charge customers sales tax and forward that money onto the state.
Glenn Beck’s news website, The Blaze, put the story on its front page Saturday and within an hour of posting, the tale received 75 comments from readers, with a good majority mocking the staffers of the commission. Several other news outlets across the nation picked up on the story as well.
The news drew the ire of commentators at the Huckleberries Online, an Idaho news blog hosted by the Spokesman Review. ”It appears that common sense is NOT a job requirement for the Idaho tax commission field rep position,” said Soaf, a blogger on the site. ”You’d think bureaucrats would have some sort of inner antenna that’d tell them when they’re going to get their fingers rapped,” criticized Dave Oliveria, administrator of the site and writer for the paper.
Note: See what the mother, Kami Charais, had to say about the situation with the tax commission here.
I thought this was America…does this mean they need a permit to have a yard sale too??
So I guess kool-aid stands are out of the question too>>Idiots…….
@Sue Roberts
Sounds like you are a hack for the local government bureaucrats who tried to shut down a huge money making enterprise.
Go get a life
This is the most ridiculous thing I have ever seen. The idiot from the tax commission needs a serious ass chewing. What the hell, let the kids have some fun and make some money. There was something else I was going to say, what was it. Oh yea, Republican state which means those kids do not have a chance.
THIS DOES NOT SURPRISE ME @ ALL!!!!! ALL THAT’S LEFT IS 4 THE GOVERNMENT 2 STAND OUTSIDE OUR DOORS & TAX US AS WE GO IN & OUT!!! UGH!!!!!!
Check out The Real Hit Squad On youtube for latest “don’t go in Naked” with the IRS Video on the Great Idaho Pumpkin Patch Debacle!
The state of Idaho should be ashamed. The children did not have the cognitive development to understand what taxes were, and I’m sure they still don’t. I found the Mother’s thought on how to pay for her childrens sports activities and teach her children responsibility was brilliant with the way our economy is.
They had hundreds of pumpkins and were selling them by the pound. The kids were just window dressing; there is no way those kids could move all those pumpkins and tally the sales. Shame on the parents! Had the parents wanted to teach their kids to be entrepreneurs, they would have taken them to get the permit and showed them how to be responsible. Now instead of paying for sports involvement they have to pay fines. Idiot parents.
This is a republican state, therefore big business takes out little man or little boys..
Forget big business and help the little man or little boys.
CHEERS
Wow. It doesn’t take much to get folks worked up on Idaho! To tax or not to tax. At face value, it would seem like the original “Pumpkin Police” detective woke up on the wrong side of bed and needed more fiber. Who knows. Maybe she’s being treated poorly by her boss or maybe she has a family member going through a rough time. Maybe her kids are sick with cancer. Dunno. For whatever reason, she missed the opportunity to be a gracious servant of the county and provide a helpful lesson to some kids. She could have asked more questions (how long are you going to be doing this? how much money are we talking about?). Instead, she copped an attitude and really blew it. She never followed through with her threat (from what I can tell). Maybe she saw the crowd. Maybe she drove away and felt like a total knucklehead but didn’t have the emotional strength to turn around and apologize. And if she did now, nobody would accept it anyway.
She was quick to judge. She was quick to condemn. She was quick to have an attitude.
HOWEVER… it would appear that most of the folks commenting have done the same. Who knows. Maybe her boss read her the riot act about this. Maybe she will end up losing her job. It would appear that most folks here would love it if she were fired for making this mistake. Fired for not having the wisdom to use the situation as a teaching moment. But I”m wondering if, instead of looking to have her fired, we should be embracing the teaching moment mentality for her. Rather that skewering her online and demanding her head on a platter, we should practice what we preach. What should she have done with the kids? How SHOULD this have been handled. Let’s take that approach. We can set our own example for the kids. Or we can be just as harsh and uncaring as she was.
I work at a hospital where couples arrive together and only one goes home. Where parents bring their children to find out they have a brutal disease. Where folks recover only to find out that they have a $100k bill waiting for them.
I have a neighbor who just returned to duty in Afghanistan. A brother with cancer who can no longer work.
Folks, there are tragedies in this world. But this isn’t of them. There is NO doubt that there is plenty of foolishness in what happened. But these kids weren’t irreparably damaged. In fact, they learned an important lesson in how NOT to treat people!
As for Sue Robert… you make a ‘technically correct’ point. But to be honest, you’ve come across like an arrogant legalistic bonehead who can’t recognize the audience and the circunstances and tailor your counterpoint appropriately. Where DO you draw the line? If an older couple on welfare are selling pumpkins to pay for their meds, do we make they get a permit? If there is an adult run stand a mile down the road that’s paying taxes, they might have valid complaint. But to be honest, the context here is pretty clear. This ‘appears to be’ the equivalent of a roadside lemonade stand. And that’s why most folks don’t seem to like you much right now.
I’m reminded of the old verse “Let him who is without sin throw the first stone”. You don’t have to be a Christian to appreciate the value of that mentality. We could all be a bit more gracious.
As for the government? It does seem to be a bit over the top lately! So, we vote. But let’s vote FOR things, not just AGAINST things… lest we replace one group of idiots with another!
Have a great night folks! And you two kids… get a good job. Pay your taxes, and keep Social Security funded long enough for me to get a little of it with the time comes!!!
To the “Great Pumpkin”…If I came across as an arrogant legalistic bonehead, I do apologize. That was never my intent. My intent was to express the facts. And the facts are that this incident was blown way out of proportion. Just to clarify…the kids were not at home at the time of the visit. The stand was not shut down. They were asked to acquire a permit which is asked of all retailers. Pumpkin stands, lemonade stands, taco vendors, farmers market, fruit stands, etc. And to answer you question about an elderly couple selling pumpkins….. collecting sales tax does not affect the money they make from their pumpkin sales. It’s something that we as consumers pay. I would gladly purchase a pumpkin from them and pay my 6% sales tax. Based on the pictures of the pumpkin patch, there were a lot more pumpkins there than a 4 and 6 year old could haul. There is more to the story. I would suggest to everyone, that they consider getting the “whole story” before they make degrading comments. Everyone seems to be so judgemental when it comes to government employees with no understanding of how difficult their job really is. Try walking in their shoes for a few miles before you start shooting. I stand with my values and belief that you abide by the law.
@ Charles Salzmann…..maybe you should lose your “Wholly than Thou” attitude dude. Who are you to make degrading comments about someone you don’t even know? Try looking in the mirror first before you start slinging mud. Have a great evening!!
@ Sue Robert: Understood. And as I suggested, you may be technically correct. And I wondered the same thing. The article seemed to be a bit weak on the details. What did seem to come across is that the person was somewhat (very?) abrasive when it wasn’t necessary. Personally, I think THAT is what tended to drive the passionate responses. And when passions get that high, it’s hard to refocus the discussion. THAT is where I was suggesting you missed the mark. And that’s just my humble opinion. Doesn’t make it true. No worries. As I said previously, this is a small issue to me. I’m sure the kids are fine and the family will get their 15-minutes of fame over it (which is fine with me). The tax lady will probably lose her job, which seems a bit harsh for a mistake (geez, if we’re going to start firing people whenever they make a mistake… unemployment will jump to 99% by Friday). I’m more than willing to give the tax gal a break for having a really bad day. Who knows what’s going on in her life. I’m sure it will never happen again with her.
Sorry to see some of the personal assaults directed towards you. Unnecessary. Life is short. Treat people well.
Go and do good…
Yeh, Big Brother is watching everything now a days, You have to vote for people who will respect our values and rights that we grew up with and not todays wacky world of cut throat politics and money grabbing local governments…
Dean
@The Great Pumpkin says:
How does your hospital experience have any bearing on commentary about government control freaks who think they can regulate everything from birth to death? People dying is much more acceptable to me than a ass wipe with a badge harassing a couple of toddlers. Dying is normal obsessivley controlling what people do and think is not.
No good revenuers.
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What the heck is this world coming too?
So, not even the simplest jobs can sustain the weight of Obama’s control. What a picture of American commerce as a whole.
Vote the lib-tards out on Nov 2!
@ Ed Edwards: My point was simply that this is a relatively small issue for folks to get so up in arms about. I’m sure the tax gal was just as much a control freak BEFORE Obama. It wasn’t like the Dem’s came around and told all government workers to be jerks on a power trip. I was in construction for years. The people in the permits and inspections department are some SERIOUS power freaks (they make this gal look like “Miss Congeniality”). They’ve been that way for 40 years. We could vote in an entire congress of conservatives… and there would still be idiots without a ton of oversight who think they can muscle people around. And it’s not just ‘government’ employees who are power freaks. Bill collectors. Health Insurance companies. Phone companies. They all have their share of idiots working for them. The point was that idiocy isn’t rooted in political ideology.
Anyway, wasn’t trying to get anyone more worked up. I was simply suggesting that the media tends to take relatively harmless (albeit insane) incidents like this and get folks all worked up about them. As for working at a hospital… you’re mistaken. Death is not a natural part of life that we should just accept. And I’m hard pressed to believe you could find the strength to say that to the parents of a dying child. Or to the woman who was hit by a stray bullet while sitting at a red-light or beaten to the brink by an a-hole husband. Personally, I’d rather deal with the obnoxious tax lady. And you may note that I was clear that it was just my opinion. As I said, I didn’t see any irreparable harm done here that couldn’t be addressed with a suspension or whatever.
Now, all that said… I still say “Vote the bums out”… but there will still be idiots on power trips…
In “little house on the prarie” emma could have sold a pumpkin and no tax man would bother her.
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I have to add my two cents to this story. I know Patty Gilmore and she is a verocious, mean, antagonizing, self-serving, hippocritcial, egotistical junk yard dog of a tax commission employee.
DO NOT PITTY HER!! This is her everyday M.O., she deserves everything she gets, because I believe you reap what you sow.
After working with Patty over the years I can tell you that she is one of the worst examples of a State employee, and personally I hope she looses her job. She continually sets a bad example of what a true “public servant” is supposed to be as an agent of the government.
What has happened to this country? Our children cant have a pumpkin stand or lemonade stand? Seriously people!!! No its not people its the politicians and the government. What a crock. That is downright shameful!!!!
I’ve dealt with Idaho bureaucrats before. The story sounds very familliar. Don’t do business there unless you absolutely have to.
Thanks MSN for bringing the rest of the country into this debate 45 days after it happened.
To comment on the “kid” business that has gotten so many up in arms. A lemonade stand or a yard sale is up for a few hours and then down. These parents have pulled the wool over many who have posted comments. This is their business and not the kids. Does anyone believe the children have the ability of weighing pumpkins, calculating total price, and then handling the money exchange? I work to pay for my children’s sports, but I have to first pay taxes on the money I make.
Zoning laws are meant to protect business owners who have paid for a nice facility for others to shop. They also, protect neighbors from having to be inconvenienced by increased traffic in a residential neighborhood where people are trying to have daily yard sales.
The sales tax law is meant to benefit everyone. If the parents of these children think the money from the sale of a few pumpkins should be tax exempt, than the same should be true for all other small businesses. AND if everything is sales tax exempt, who is going to pay for the education of these poor kids.
Get a life. If you want to have a business, play by the rules. Your kids are not running that stand, you are!
They wanted a 6 and 4 year old to get a permit to sell pumpkins? This is just some government idiot’s attempt to destroy what little creativity and responsibility todays kids have. It’s not the parents’ fault either,most sane people don’t think the government is going to go to court over some kids’ pumpkin stand when there is so much more they COULD be doing.
As if we needed another reason to despise government officials…